I can never decide if Bryan is talking about open borders as a general concept or about open borders as it relates to the US. As far as Europe is concerned, most people now agree that unselective mass immigration from the West Indies, Pakistan, the Middle East and Africa has, on the whole, been bad both economically and culturally for native Europeans.
I see. So you are saying that mass immigration is the punishment Europeans deserve for the sins of their ancestors. Since mass immigration is a punishment, you therefore agree with me that it's bad for Europe. Got it.
I guess you also believe Turkey should be invaded because of the sins committed under the Ottoman Empire?
And do you also believe the son of Lee harvey Oswald should be imprisoned for the assassination of JFK?
Deserve implies moral values. I tend to subscribe to moral error theory myself but it requires no morality to observe that putting your hand to a flame burns you. The European powers convinced themselves that they had a civilising mission and even after they gave up ruling the benighted foreigner, they couldn’t kick the habit. The Ottomans, to their benefit, never dreamed of anything so silly and their descendants reap the rewards of their pragmatism. As for Lee Harvey Oswald’s son, I doubt he has a pleasant childhood as the son of a murderer. That’s his cross to bear from pops.
A slippery reply which didn't answer any of my questions. Ever thought of going into politics? In case you need reminding of what my questions were:
1. Do you think mass immigration to the west is suitable punishment for its previous colonialism?
2. Should Turkey also be punished with the mass invasion of people from its former empire or does its 'pragmatism' give it a pass?
3. Do you think a son should always inherit the sins of his father or is it only in the case of western colonialism? If so, when should this guilt expire? After 5 generations? 100 generations? Never?
1. I literally answered this as plainly as possible. ‘Punishment’ requires morality. Being burned is not a punishment for putting your hand on the stove.
2.Turkey wasn’t stupid enough to embrace an ideology that demand the weak be protected by the strong.
3.There is no ‘should’, there is only ‘will.’ Adopting a stupid ideology will affect not only yourself but future generations. How long? As long as they hold to that ideology and then however long it takes to correct their mistakes.
You seem to be under the impression that I’m pro mass immigration. I’m not. I simply have no respect for a Western culture that built a rod for its own back or the throwbacks who want to preserve it.
One needs to think about what it means to be culturally American. Listening to American pop music, eating hamburgers, and liking American porn while remaining vehemently anti-American, marrying your cousin, and cheating anybody outside your family are completely compatible. Assimilation takes more than one or two generations.
I agree with Garrett Jones that ancestry does have a powerful impact on current (and past) levels of economic development, but the ancestral “SAT scores” – state history (S), agriculture (A), and technology (T) is not really the key variable. The problem is that the theory does not account for Northwest Europe or the United States.
It is "Society Type" that is the key causal variable. Or more accurately society type of ancestors in the year 1500.
Is there any research that controls the agricultural component of the SAT scores for the length of the growing season?
I could see this having a big impact. It’s one thing to develop agriculture. It’s another to develop agriculture in an environment where you have to save crops for a long winter (and savings is a part of what drives economic growth).
I would also be interested in seeing if the state history component has been adjusted for things like the Arabic expansion, the Mongolian invasions, or even the discovery of America.
It’s my understanding that these events drove many people westward. Such that the individuals who populate Syria today, are not fully descended from the people who populated it during the reign of Byzantium.
I think these two things may explain why Americans/Europeans score higher than SAT would predict.
Is your wife Jewish or Romanian? Jews are difficult to deal with in this economist 'SAT' model, as they lacked a homeland for most of the time.
I can never decide if Bryan is talking about open borders as a general concept or about open borders as it relates to the US. As far as Europe is concerned, most people now agree that unselective mass immigration from the West Indies, Pakistan, the Middle East and Africa has, on the whole, been bad both economically and culturally for native Europeans.
The sins of the fathers are visited upon the sons. Europeans ought to have travelled the globe as merchants and left the priests and soldiers at home.
I see. So you are saying that mass immigration is the punishment Europeans deserve for the sins of their ancestors. Since mass immigration is a punishment, you therefore agree with me that it's bad for Europe. Got it.
I guess you also believe Turkey should be invaded because of the sins committed under the Ottoman Empire?
And do you also believe the son of Lee harvey Oswald should be imprisoned for the assassination of JFK?
Deserve implies moral values. I tend to subscribe to moral error theory myself but it requires no morality to observe that putting your hand to a flame burns you. The European powers convinced themselves that they had a civilising mission and even after they gave up ruling the benighted foreigner, they couldn’t kick the habit. The Ottomans, to their benefit, never dreamed of anything so silly and their descendants reap the rewards of their pragmatism. As for Lee Harvey Oswald’s son, I doubt he has a pleasant childhood as the son of a murderer. That’s his cross to bear from pops.
A slippery reply which didn't answer any of my questions. Ever thought of going into politics? In case you need reminding of what my questions were:
1. Do you think mass immigration to the west is suitable punishment for its previous colonialism?
2. Should Turkey also be punished with the mass invasion of people from its former empire or does its 'pragmatism' give it a pass?
3. Do you think a son should always inherit the sins of his father or is it only in the case of western colonialism? If so, when should this guilt expire? After 5 generations? 100 generations? Never?
1. I literally answered this as plainly as possible. ‘Punishment’ requires morality. Being burned is not a punishment for putting your hand on the stove.
2.Turkey wasn’t stupid enough to embrace an ideology that demand the weak be protected by the strong.
3.There is no ‘should’, there is only ‘will.’ Adopting a stupid ideology will affect not only yourself but future generations. How long? As long as they hold to that ideology and then however long it takes to correct their mistakes.
You seem to be under the impression that I’m pro mass immigration. I’m not. I simply have no respect for a Western culture that built a rod for its own back or the throwbacks who want to preserve it.
One needs to think about what it means to be culturally American. Listening to American pop music, eating hamburgers, and liking American porn while remaining vehemently anti-American, marrying your cousin, and cheating anybody outside your family are completely compatible. Assimilation takes more than one or two generations.
I agree with Garrett Jones that ancestry does have a powerful impact on current (and past) levels of economic development, but the ancestral “SAT scores” – state history (S), agriculture (A), and technology (T) is not really the key variable. The problem is that the theory does not account for Northwest Europe or the United States.
It is "Society Type" that is the key causal variable. Or more accurately society type of ancestors in the year 1500.
I explain why in more detail in this article:
https://frompovertytoprogress.substack.com/p/does-the-origin-of-agriculture-explain
and more generally here:
https://frompovertytoprogress.substack.com/p/why-our-deep-history-explains-global
Is there any research that controls the agricultural component of the SAT scores for the length of the growing season?
I could see this having a big impact. It’s one thing to develop agriculture. It’s another to develop agriculture in an environment where you have to save crops for a long winter (and savings is a part of what drives economic growth).
I would also be interested in seeing if the state history component has been adjusted for things like the Arabic expansion, the Mongolian invasions, or even the discovery of America.
It’s my understanding that these events drove many people westward. Such that the individuals who populate Syria today, are not fully descended from the people who populated it during the reign of Byzantium.
I think these two things may explain why Americans/Europeans score higher than SAT would predict.
As far as I know no one has looked at effect of growing season on state formation. I do go into the topic of Growing season in this article:
https://frompovertytoprogress.substack.com/p/more-ways-geography-has-constrained